Monday, March 26, 2007

NIMBY

Now that there is a huge push on to reduce our fossil fuel consumption, one of the highly-touted alternatives is that of increasing nuclear power production.

However, the Toronto Star reports this morning that highly-urbanized areas in Southern Ontario are being considered for long-term disposal.

So we all want to be green, and we still want our precious power, but are we willing to deal with the waste-storage fallout?

18 comments:

Anonymous said...

Ontario is as large as Europe, we're in the second largest country in the world - and we ship out our garbage because the people here don't act like adults and don't elect adult leaders.

People in Ontario are going to spend A LOT of money buying power from somewhere else. That's our 'choice' by default, and that power will probably come from coal fired plants just over our border.

PGP said...

Look up East-West Hydro power grid!

You will soon be buying a lot of electricity from Manitoba!

Chuckercanuck said...

well, the best is to dispose of it somewhere in the canadian shield, but nuclear waste is not as big a deal as people make it sound.

I wouldn't be putting it in southern ontario, but I wouldn't panic either. safe storage exists.

Chuckercanuck said...

(contrary to what Stephane Dion says).

PGP said...

I believe that DiDi's beloved socialist paradise of Fwance is 80% powered by nuclear electric generation.

Anonymous said...

Sue-Ann Levy (Toronto Sun columnist) wrote an interesting series of articles while she was in Milan, Italy researching their environmental/garbage disposal programs. She compares their programs to Toronto's.

Scroll down and you'll find that they are still posted.

http://www.torontosun.com/News/
Columnists/Levy_Sue-Ann/

raz

liberal supporter said...

I believe that DiDi's beloved socialist paradise of Fwance is 80% powered by nuclear electric generation.

Funny, that. Maybe he's not just a cat's paw for the French government after all.

(contrary to what Stephane Dion says).

Could you provide a reference?

In this article, after praising Stephen Harper, it praises Dion saying he does not rule out nuclear power, but we need a strategy for the waste. Since the nuclear industry wants the government to foot the $24 BILLION cost, perhaps he has a point.

Given the volume, how much more trouble is it to ship it north? It's not like the Toronto garbage, with dozens of trucks a day. I thought the current storage for the past 30 years' worth is an Olympic pool sized tank 26 feet deep.

Chuckercanuck said...

no link. he said he was not interested in nuclear power because, as you said, he didn't see a solution for handling the waste.

if he's changed his mind, excellent! another flip flop that Canada needs.

Gabby in QC said...

For those wondering about France's nuclear power and other facts about nuclear power, here are some links:

http://tinyurl.com/2wmoum
Nuclear power by country

http://tinyurl.com/3d5nrt
France and Nuclear Energy

http://tinyurl.com/2ze8ga
Basic facts about Nuclear Power Plants in the World

http://tinyurl.com/yrj4a7
Share of nuclear power in the total production of electricity

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Thanks, Gabby. What's your impression of the election so far?

Gabby in QC said...

You're welcome, Joanne.

I have very mixed feelings. I welcome the rise of a conservative centre-right party, the ADQ, but it does not yet have enough strong candidates or a clear vision of where to take the province.

Unfortunately, Jean Charest shot himself in the foot by immediately taking 700 million from the equalization package to give to Quebecers as tax cuts. That was a MAJOR mistake, IMO.

Actually, Charest's leadership may be at risk. I hope his "defeat" - because coming in with a minority govt. IS a defeat, especially with Charest even in danger of losing his own seat - I hope it doesn't affect PM Harper's chances in the next federal election. Let's hope the pundits are right: that those who voted ADQ are/may be supporters of Mr. Harper.

I also find a minority government further stalls Quebec in its "immobilisme" - its inability to move forward with any kind of innovation. Charest tried to make some changes early in his first mandate, but he had to back down because of the unions & other opposition.

The one bright light is that the PQ has lost some support. The ROC should not cry "separatism is dead" though. It is simply undergoing a transformation.

Also the results show a dichotomy between the regions/rural & Montreal/the cosmopolitan.

Finally, so much for Quebec leading Canada in its concern for the environment. I don't think a Green has been elected or anywhere near being elected.

Chuckercanuck said...

"Also the results show a dichotomy between the regions/rural & Montreal/the cosmopolitan."

how can there be progress in Quebec without that dichotomy being present and visible?

when I lived in Rouyn-Noranda, I learned a very valuable lesson:

Rouyn is more like Timmins than it is like Montreal.

Montreal is more like Toronto than it is like Rouyn.

Toronto is more like Montreal than it is like Timmins.

That is a fundamental fact that separatists have obscured to our detriment for too long.

Facts must come before progress. Progress ain't real without the facts.

Candace said...

Gabby: "I also find a minority government further stalls Quebec in its "immobilisme" - its inability to move forward with any kind of innovation. Charest tried to make some changes early in his first mandate, but he had to back down because of the unions & other opposition."

If Charest and Dumont work together on innovations, Quebec wins. Or, alternatively, maybe he can work with the PQ on innovations if Dumont doesn't like those particular innovations.

I don't know which of the 2 older parties is more tied up with the unions, so covered both bases. That's one reason I love AB politics. Unions don't count for much of anything. Of course, the down side of that is big business DOES. Most businessmen, however, aren't stupid so won't usually shoot themselves in the foot via messing with their employees (especially in today's market).

It's nice having that knife removed from the neck, even if only for a while.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Charest tried to make some changes early in his first mandate, but he had to back down because of the unions & other opposition.

Fascinating analysis, Gabby. The public service unions seem to be a huge problem. I've heard that Mario advocates letting them thin out by attrition. Do you think that will be enough?

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Rouyn is more like Timmins than it is like Montreal.

Montreal is more like Toronto than it is like Rouyn.

Toronto is more like Montreal than it is like Timmins.


Ouch! That's like a brain-teaser.

Gabby in QC said...

I apologize to those who asked me a question or commented on what I said. After my Mon Mar 26, 10:37:00 PM EDT comment, I watched the commentary on TV.

Joanne:
"Fascinating analysis, Gabby. The public service unions seem to be a huge problem. I've heard that Mario advocates letting them thin out by attrition. Do you think that will be enough?"
You give me far too much credit.
That process, thinning out the unions, started in '97 with Lucien Bouchard, when he offered health care workers & teachers early retirement, with questionable results.
Charest had the same idea last election, but did not follow through, although union people would dispute that. Will they - Charest & Dumont - be successful this time?

ChuckerCanuck:
"how can there be progress in Quebec without that dichotomy being present and visible?"
The thing is that those two forces should ideally work in concert to go forward, whereas what seems - and I say seems because I'm not absolutely certain - what seems to be at work here is an urban/left mindset in opposition to a rural/right one. Have the Plateau (for non-Montrealers, le Plateau is an "in/hip" district) forces that have dominated so far been rejected by the rest of the population? I don't know the answer.

Candace:
"If Charest and Dumont work together on innovations, Quebec wins. Or, alternatively, maybe he can work with the PQ on innovations if Dumont doesn't like those particular innovations."
Ideally, all parties, including the public service unions, should work in concert to improve conditions in Quebec. But are Quebecers ready to make certain changes, like making more room for public/private healthcare, or tightening up the public purse to reduce the size of government & thus reduce social services? Again, I don't know.

Chuckercanuck said...

Gabby:

The ADQ did very well in Montreal vis a vis there past performance. And they cleaned house in the developing suburbs of the north shore.

Cheer up!

Its not Dumont's fault that Duceppe tried to attack "Calgary overlords" in the last election or that Boisclair didn't want to have group sex with Harper and Bush.

Its not Dumont's fault that people get offended with Le Plateau values forced down everyone's throats or that we assume mommys who want to raise their kids are evil.

Gabby in QC said...

ChuckerCanuck: "Cheer up!"

Oh, I'm not depressed. It's just my nature to be a cautious, risk-averse person.

Hmm, on the other hand, I think I was probably the only person on the island of Montreal to actually vote for the Alliance in the 2000 fed. election. What does that say about me?

"The ADQ did very well in Montreal vis a vis there past performance."
But why their breakthrough?
Is it because people liked the ADQ ideas or is it that they wanted to punish Charest?

Why punish Charest, you ask?
For the demerger mess. BIG reason.

For the perceived inaction on the health care front?
On this, I believe people are wrong. After the parade of health ministers we had under the PQ - about 8 in a row?, I don't remember - introducing changes without thinking them through, we had Minister Couillard (a doctor, who should know whereof he speaks) at the helm for 4 yrs. Slowly, painfully, there have been some improvements under his tutelage. But changing the big unwieldy machine of government is a SLOW process.
Unfortunately, I hear Couillard wants out of that ministry now.

OK, I'll limit my tendency to be long-winded & stop here ...