Saturday, May 20, 2006

More Incredibly Original Thoughts from Karen

It looks like the National Post has picked up on my disdain for lame and repetitious accusations made by the Liberals and my M.P. in particular.

Julie Smyth's House was One Martin Short for Afghan Vote gives an insiders' look at the past week in Ottawa. Smyth declares, "The opposition parties' obsessive need to deride all things American is approaching phobic proportions."


She singles out Kitchener-Centre M.P. Karen Redman among others, for some over-the-top comments made during "one session of Question Period" this past week:

- Karen Redman, Liberal Whip: "Will the Prime Minister admit that he is happy to take his orders on global warming from the White House and he wants the rest of the world to do the same?"

- Ms. Redman: "When will the Prime Minister just admit he has no made-in-Canada plan, only a made-in-the-U.S.A. plan designed by American republican pollsters?"


My Question:

When will the Honourable member from Kitchener-Centre finally admit that she has just plain run out of fresh material?



* * * * * * *

Important Update! - Another Karen Redman sighting at Riley's Political Rant. Thanks, Riley!

70 comments:

Zac said...

Regardless of Redmen, I'd like to see this "Made in Canada" plan Joanne. Also, I'd like to see how this "made in Canada" plan would combat international pollution.

I've been hearing about it since the Alliance days.

Mr Ed said...

well Zac... The Kyoto plan sure won't work...unless cleaning up the enviroment means filling the pockets of beurocrats in Costa Rica (which is what Kyoto pretty much ammounts to.) And I think the visit from Austrailian PM and discussions that spring from that meeting will come up with a more creative solution.

Regardless, until you can control 3rd world nations in Asia and Africa who burn fossil fuels for electric power to run the production sites for eevrything from your new Cellphone to that Toaster Oven, Microwave, Sterio and Plasma TV... South American nations like Brazil who are cutting down the rain forests like there's no end to that resource to provide you with your Ikea furnature, then there's China, Korea, Japan, and the Philipeans not to mention all the Meditrainian bordering countries that are poluting the Oceans and seas killing off the largest source of Oxygen on the planet by killing ocean plant life with their poluting, then there's the SUV/Mini Van driving enviromentalists, international travel where planes are constantly sturing up the upper atmosphere, etc, etc, etc

Mindlessly buying up Costa Rica's free air credits seems pretty silly now doesn't it...

Zac said...

mr ed, I'm aware of Kyoto's flaws. I'm more interested in Harper's "made in Canada" approach.

We've been hearing about it for years. He has a chance to impliment it and thus far we have heard only sparse info about it.

If Kyoto is to be scrapped or disregarded, I'd like to know what it is going to be replaced with.

Fred :) said...

Zac,

Ya gotta understand Kyoto has nothing to do with “pollution” only some green house gases (GHG), specifically CO2.

When Jean Cretin signed us up to Kyoto he and the Liberals had no idea what it meant, had no plan. Cretin was sold on the idea because it was good apple pie & motherhood thing to do and Jean was desperately looking for a legacy because he hadn’t done anything substantial while he was PM. When the big ice storms hit Quebec, David Anderson the Environment Minister used that opportunity to convince Cretin that Kyoto would prevent such things happening again. Ergo, in need of a legacy, he signed us up, without knowing the costs or impacts.


The Liberal “Plan” was to send billions of taxpayer dollars overseas to buy “credits” (pieces of paper) without actually reducing any GHG’s. That would do nothing to help the environment but it would make a few tin pot dictators much richer while hospital lineups here get longer.

Kyoto is an economic treaty, it has little to do with the environment. Because 99% of the world’s countries are exempt from actually having to do anything, other than sell credits to Canada, it will do nothing to even slow done global warming – even if you believe humans are the primary cause – which is crap by the way.

When you think of Kyoto remember that it is the same UN that brought the multi billion dollar “Oil for Food Scam” the same UN that is corrupt form the loading dock the Kofi’s office and his son’s secret Swiss bank accounts and it is all based on the multi billion dollar environmental fund raising industry that needs a scary “the sky is falling” story to keep the donations rolling in.

Always remember, the same fools that are now screaming “Global Warming, the sky is falling” were just 30 short years ago screaming “The next Ice Age is coming, the sky is falling”. Got the cover of Time magazine both times. Time made a lot of money, the environmentalists scored big in the donations department. Have you noticed that the Global warming crowd has now morphed their message to “climate change” . . . because the data doesn’t support “warming” and they are inoculating themselves against the backlash when the scientific truth comes out.

Harper & Ambrose are on the right track . . . .

Zac said...

Fred, I understand the flaws of Kyoto, I'm not disputing them. I just want to know what the new plan is?

Whats a made in Canada solution going to entail? How will it control international pollution?

If we are scrapping the Kyoto plan, what are we replacing it with?

You say that, "Harper & Ambrose are on the right track" but what is it?

Derik Foulem said...

The whole "Made in Canada" statement is a stupid game of political positionning aimed at hiding the fact the the conservatives don't seem to have a clue or give a damned about the enviroment from what I see and hear up to now.

They seem to think that by waving a Canadian flag about and playing on our Canadian sense of entitlement they can delay real action on the enviroment.

The worst is when I hear arguments about how helping the enviroment will hurt the economy too much, well I can't wait to see the consequences on our economy of not helping the enviroment.

Riley Hennessey said...

stop me cold but I'm going to agree with Zac. I think Canadian's won't care if we sign out of Kyoto as long as the Conservatives actually announce their own plan for emissions. The goal is to LOWER emissions who cares how we do it right?

I think we're all eager to find out how the Conservatives plan on doing this.


Oh and I also have my own Karen Redman quote up on my blog JUST for Joanne haha

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Thanks, Riley! That is awesome!!

I agree that the government hasn't done a great job explaining the Made in Canada plan. I'm sure those details will be forthcoming. I have heard about an effort to give incentitives to increase public transit, and help individual companies to reduce pollution at the local level. If I can find more details, I will post them.

But Kyoto is a word; it in itself does nothing to reduce greenhouse gas emissions in Canada.

Zac said...

"stop me cold but I'm going to agree with Zac."

how horrible for you riley.

Zac said...

"I have heard about an effort to give incentitives to increase public transit, and help individual companies to reduce pollution at the local level."

I hope you guys aren't planning to go to the electorate with just that.

Canadians want action on climate change, and they aren't voting Green.

Hopefully Ambrose will come up with something. She used to be my favourite Tory.

TangoJuliette said...

The "flaws" are not with Kyoto, but rather wither the hypocrites who pretended to be the protectors of our vital oxygen supplies.

Kyoto US signatory? Clinton's VP. Clinton did not ratify. But Bushie is the villain?

Our Kyoto signatories. Crettin, Martin, Dionne and the Belmonts.

The US, not signed on the dotted line, but successfully posted some reductions.

Canada, signed on the dotted line, but posting 35% INCREASES, ABOVE OUR TARGETS.

If Harper's government did nothing, Canada couldn't look worse than we did under the Liberals.

Hell's bells. Even if we COULD follow the US model, we would certainly look better than the last bunch of pseudo-"environmentalists" who blew forty million tax dollars to show the world just how bad a job the liberals could do with the environment.

And dear Karen and her crowd laugh at, and mock and revile Rona Ambrose?

More nerve than Dick Tracy. And no shame.

Yup. Libs. Looking phonier every day.

And I'm still luvvin it!

L.H. & K.

Mr Ed said...

Harpers an Economist... I'd imagine he'll offer tax breakes based on a percentage of reduction of GHG's company's can prove they're producing... The problem will be the formula to calculate it and the method to measure it. If say a company like GM were offered .5% off their fedral tax bill for every 2% they can reduce emissions they'd possibly take note and belly up.

There are company's out there like ST Micro who run Green offices and only print minimal POS and internal reports... I know one way we could cut down the use of paper i all gov't offices by ~50% and that would be to offer the forms in only one official lamguage instead of Bi-lingual... How many french Canadians are there in Rural BC or Alberta vs English Canadians in Rural Quebec??? Political suicide but it would cut waist by ~50%

Zac said...

So, this is the "made in Canada" solution?

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Tango - "If Harper's government did nothing, Canada couldn't look worse than we did under the Liberals."

lol!! I'm loving it!

There is some information at Rona's site, which links to the M.of E.:
http://www.ec.gc.ca/press_e.html

"She outlined the recent $1.7 billion investment in new cleaner transportation to get Canadians out of their cars and into public transit. The Minister also noted that the Government will work, in collaboration with the provinces and territories, to move forward on a 5% average renewable content in Canadian motor fuels. Increased use of renewable fuels will result in real, tangible benefits to the environment and economic benefits to the agricultural sector as well as others."

Mr. Ed - Thanks for the info. A bit over my head, but much appreciated.

Riley Hennessey said...

Zac,

Relax, agreeing with you isn't so horrible I was just trying to be funny.. guess it didn't work.

Ambrose is still my favorite Tory cause she is by far the hottest MP in parliament and she gets attacked the most so I give her credit for a strong spine.

Also did anyone catch her on Rick Mercer's show when they tapped Maple Syrup from trees together? Hilarious.

Transit passes and 5% renewable fuels isn't going to be enough for me. I want to see some real policy ideas. Martin didn't seem to have any either so I'm not pretending any party has great solutions, just saying I'd really like to see some.

My best suggestion for the environment would be to heavily invest in sewage treatment plants in cities, invest in university research on more fuel efficient automobile engines (there are plenty of uni's doing this, invest in a national power grid to coordinate energy uses (which would hopefully lower them) and continue with the public transit and biofuels scheme of the Cons.

Seriously though a national power grid and new technologies for sewage treatment would go a lot farther than people think. We're dumping tons of garbage into our rivers and oceans and following the example of cities like ThunderBay Ontario would be a huge improvement for Canada.

HearHere said...

May 18, 2006 STANDARD-FREEHOLDER
Rookie environment minister taking heat over climate change

She's stopped telling the lie and unleashed a major hoopla in a portfolio that was never one of Harper's top priorities

Don Martin CanWest News Service OTTAWA

The bureaucrats suggested she duck. Keep her head down for another 18 months until safely after the next election. Pretend the Kyoto accord was a pollution-reduction target fact and not a mission-impossible fiction.

In other words, continue spreading the big Liberal lie even knowing the former government's $10-billion plan would never come close to cutting greenhouse gas emissions to a level six per cent below 1990 levels.

To her credit, Environment Minister Rona Ambrose arrived at her new job and asked them to translate the Kyoto-enforced reduction of 195 megatonnes of carbon into terms she could understand.

The bureaucrats fiddled with calculators and pencils. Well, they said, it's a bit more than all the power generation in Canada. If the country went dark and cut back a few hundred thousand cars, it could hit the target.

That's when the rubber hit the road for the petite firecracker MP from Alberta. She declared Kyoto, as we know it in Canada, dead.

Ambrose takes the chair job in Bonn, Germany, this week at an international conference on climate change in a curious position. She'll represent the first signatory of the Kyoto accord to publicly admit her home country can't meet its treaty commitment of reducing gas emissions to six per cent below 1990 levels.

Long before the $45 million (!!!!!) conference in Montreal in the thick of last November's election campaign, the event where an electioneering Paul Martin scolded the United States for having a superior gas-reduction record, that much was obvious.

"At that time, they knew we could not meet the targets and no one said a word," Ambrose said in an interview Friday. "We could have kept lying and continued through the next election, but I told them we should admit it and get out of the target business. It sent shock waves through the department. But that doesn't mean we should stop trying."

TRIUMPH OVER PIPEDREAMS
In a triumph of pragmatism over pipedreams, Ambrose went to work eliminating plans to purchase hot air abroad in favour of tangible investments at home.

She killed Canadian plans to purchase a forest in Costa Rica as part of the Kyoto caper.
She vetoed trips by senior environment officials to Russia to buy fixer-upper factoriese for the emission credits they could generate.

And she axed a continuing push to direct Canadian foreign aid and development assistance away from the most needy recipients into the hands of less-deserving beneficiaries just because they offered clean-up credits.

"The tentacles of this target-chasing went through almost every department," she says. "That really blew my mind."
And yet, she hedges still in delivering last rights to the contentious global treaty, pushing for Canada's greenhouse gas reduction requirements to be softened.

By how much? you ask. She doesn't know. "If we set a domestic target, it will be a reachable target."

And what's the penalty if we break our international commitment? Again, she doesn't know for sure.

But on this point, Ambrose sounds resolute. Canadian taxpayers will not be sending billions overseas to buy hot air rights. The money to fight our pollution will be invested in Canadian know-how.

It sounds simplistic. But transferring pollution rights from countries that have no intention of polluting to those seeking a bigger carbon belch doesn't add up to a reduced global discharge in my rudimentary math. OK, true, companies forced to pay for their pollution will find ways to eliminate it, but it still smacks of a massive transfer of wealth from developed to developing countries, which might not be the best Earth-saving strategy.

So give Ambrose credit. She's stopped telling the lie and unleashed a major hoopla in a portfolio that was never one of Stephen Harper's top priorities.

Beyond the greenhouse gas fight, she has set in motion water, air and soil reviews, an environmental-protection overhaul and a renewable energy strategy, which will be unveiled in a few weeks.

But the toughest fight will be killing Kyoto once and for all. "It's not like I don't know the Liberals haven't sold Kyoto to Canadians. It's got the support of 89 per cent of Quebecers. But we've got to tell Canadians the truth."

That's one heckuva green minister talking. But in this department, that's a compliment

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Herehere, thanks for that. Don Martin has been a bit cranky of late, but we'll take it for what it's worth.

Riley, I agree with you. I want to see a concrete solution to pollution, or at least an effort. I hate going for a walk and suffocating on car exhaust fumes!

But honestly, how is Kyoto going to solve that problem? Sending money to Russia to buy credits does not make the air cleaner here. We live in one of the worst areas for pollution (Southern Ontario). It stinks. Plain and simple.

PGP said...

When will the good citizens of Kitchener-Centre stop voting for TWITS???
;)

Zac said...

"Relax, agreeing with you isn't so horrible I was just trying to be funny.. guess it didn't work."

Yeah, my post was sort of a joke there too Riley. I guess its hard to get sarcasim across when we're typing. Meh, either way.
++++
"Ambrose is still my favorite Tory cause she is by far the hottest MP in parliament"

I think we can both agree on that one. Perhaps, we should mount an effort to have her cross the floor. From what I can tell all the attractive female MP's like to be with the LPC.

I think any of the young liberal events can attest to that also.

Ever been to a young CPC event? Yeah, no hotties anywhere. Kinda depressing...kinda sad.

Zac said...

"But honestly, how is Kyoto going to solve that problem?"

Kyoto is flawed, I've been saying that for sometime now. A made in Canada solution is all well and fine, but we need to find ways to end 3rd world reliance on coal energy and we need to get smaller, industrialized nations on board. We can cut our emissions all we want. In fact, we can produce no emissions, but it won't do much good without the rest of the world on board.

++++

"We live in one of the worst areas for pollution (Southern Ontario). It stinks. Plain and simple."

Yeah, southern ontario sucks for pollution but try being in Hamilton. If I make it to 30 without lung cancer, I'll jump for joy. This city is god-awful when it comes to emissions.

Riley Hennessey said...

Zac,

I posted a long reply to your statements over on my blog and I'm dieing to hear your response about the Liberal party principles.

I have to disagree about young CPC ladies... I happen to know a couple fire-brand Conservative foxes who would dispel your myth. Ambrose isn't alone... ever see some of the young CPC staffers on the hill? It's enough to make any redblooded Liberal turn blue.. haha

Chuckercanuck said...

great post, joanne. Karen Redmen is yankophobic and like any other phobia, she should be shamed out of mainstream politics.

(Zac, Kyoto is useless and because its useless it makes a mockery of the concept of multilateralism and international treaties.)

vicki said...

guys,guys,guys...Ambrose is beautiful, but her real asset is her brains and she is principled.And that article from hearhear proves it!!They are starting with exposing the liberal abuse of so called 'environmental spending'...aka beurocratic waste.
So if all it takes is 'looks' to join the Libs...(naaah...lets not bring up Belinda again...)
I would like to see some incentive for solar and wind energy. Also Toronto needs a new garbage policy soon...any experts on incineration out there? What do you think?

Zac said...

"(Zac, Kyoto is useless and because its useless it makes a mockery of the concept of multilateralism and international treaties.)"

Yes CC, it is useless...I've been saying that for some time now.

Don't worry, we're on the same page for once.

Riley Hennessey said...

Zac,

Still waiting for you to grill me on my liberal principle comment over at my blog.

We all agree Kyoto is just a word and useless. I think the deal here is that we're all interested in what the government is going to do about Canada's environment. I'm ready for some debate. There are tons of simple things we can do to lower our own emissions, and set trends in other countries.

Zac said...

Riley, I posted something. You may not like it, but either way..its how I see things.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

PGP - "When will the good citizens of Kitchener-Centre stop voting for TWITS???'

Please come here and stage an intervention! We need help. The problem is that people in this area like the status quo. It is a bit scary for them to be thinking about change.

TangoJuliette said...

Hey Zacster!

Stand by! Stay Alert! Keep your eyes peeled, 'cause things are going to start happening faster and faster around this NEW & IMPROVED OTTAWA.

You don't seem to like the prospect of a possible Conservative version of a 'made in Canada' environmental solution.

Do you really prefer the Liberal 35% increase in Canada's environmental PO-lution?

Two more years of THAT kind of environmental stewardship, and you'd have to have been counting yourself lucky to be making it to twenty-seven, Steel-Town residency notwithstanding. Keep defending the indefensible. It's a hoot to watch. And, of course, as you are now very well aware . . .

this is me laffin', 'cause you all sound like you resemble cold and shivering little half-drowned rodents trying to escape the Titanic before the suction take you all down with it, and it's all so charmingly pathetic . . . and . . . I'M LOVING IT!!! But you probably already quessed that, I'll bet, didn't you? I just can't seem to sneak ONE SINGLE THING past you, can I?

L.H. & K.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Vicki - That's an interesting comment about Toronto's garbage problem. From my perspective it looks like McGuinty and Miller are burying their heads in the trash.

Contrary to what Omar says, I think it is the Liberals that pray the problem goes away, while the Conservatives tend to take action.

Zac said...

Hey Tangster!!!

You told me to "Keep defending the indefensible" but I havent been defending Kyoto. In fact, I've been saying that is it useless.

Zac said...

"I have to disagree about young CPC ladies..."

I don't know Riley, I've been to a few CPC youth events and let me tell you, its like an animal testing facility.

Either way, the young Lib ladies are muuuuuuch better.

TangoJuliette said...

Zac The Impatient and the Shallow:

Give Harper 13 years and he could come up with something that'd just might be a tad better than a 35% increase in killer emissions. You're making it sound like this kind of failure, after all that kind of time, is so much better than honesty after 100 days. hoooo-HAH!!

"...Ever been to a young CPC event? Yeah, no hotties anywhere. Kinda depressing ...kinda sad..."

I'm guessing that when the Young CPC females see guys like you coming down the road towards them, they just use their god-given intelligence to get their god-given feet to move their god-given beauty going down the road away from you.

I think it has something to do with natural selection and survival of the fittest. That'd be "fittest" not "most vapid and vacuous."

The young lib-oriented swain offers up a very typical reaction to his failed encountering of someone with exacting standards. "...depressing...sad..." then launch an attack aime at the CPC females on the extremely subjective basis of some superficial values.

It's all so, like, just soooo shallow:

"gee. you're all such smart women. with standards. won't even give poor little hard-drinking me the time of day. well...you're not good looking anyway. i wouldn't even ever return your calls should you find yourselves sooo desperate that you might condescend to give me a call after finding my name and number listed under Dorks on some shabby bathroom wall..."

ciao, sweet loser ~

I'm....ya know....like ... just SOO-O-O LUH-ving IT!!


L.H.& K.

Tango Juliette said...

For those of you who haven't been able to come up with a definition of neo-con.

We're the ones with the dog-eared copy of our international hidden-agenda rolled up in our back pocket. We're the ones with the special propeller beanie in our secret colour-coded badges of rank. We're the ones with the secret compass - decoder ring - with built in water squirting machinery. We're the ones with the plans to turn all our children into criminals, raising them on a steady diet of popcorn and beers. We're also the ones with tasty recipes on how to cook up and fry your children for lunch for our evil master. We are also the ones with the plans and know-how on how to get the sun to rise in the west, and we know the secrets of how to guarantee that the sky will fall tomorrow morning. We also are the ones with that ultra-right-wing conspiratorial uber secret handshake. llibs, hags and kisses~


set to hez,99.5/plk{}[]-<...,,...,> 2 left 2 right:

iuwhuhfrgthhknendireuiournkjnsiow983476542birt34j5i6h68u34524iufh982y4by321t34bhii.,230j8rth.lgtrh][pc[']\86 39=8
~blpftksjiuy

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Zac - If you feel that any of the above is a personal attack or insult, please let me know.

Chucker - "Yankophobic" Perfect! I was searching for a word like that. I may borrow it sometime. Thanks!

Joanne (True Blue) said...

"I don't know Riley, I've been to a few CPC youth events and let me tell you, its like an animal testing facility."

What? Please explain!

RGM said...

Disappointing to see misogyny make an appearance to link a female's political value to her looks. Thumbs up to Vicki for calling the guys out.

I've made my Kyoto comments over at my own place; suffice to say I'm happy to hear of yesterday's news.

The increasing frequency and intensity of the rhetoric used to bash Harper by linking him to Bush is both entertaining and sad at the same time. The left clearly has no salient direction on a lot of international issues in order to focus a true critique of Canadian policy, so instead it goes on anti-Bush rant. Elizabeth May, a Green Party leadership candidate, did not mention Harper's name once in her appearance on NewsNet yesterday but she sure loved to talk about how Bush is the root of all evil. There was a time when opposition parties actually concentrated on the Canadian government instead of the American Administration.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Thanks, RGM. A good post on your site.

Releasing a bunch of hot air about Bush is not going to accomplish anything.

TangoJuliette said...

"...Joanne (True Blue) said...
Zac - If you feel that any of the above is a personal attack or insult, please let me know..."

Joanne True Blue:

Ask the same question of your other female readers and contributors.

You think there might be some post that Zac might find to be " a personal attack or insult...?"

You mean apart from some of his own writing? How about him tossing out a few 'mea cuplas' for his male chauvinistic pig attitude about CPC young women who he sees as "...I've been to a few CPC youth events and let me tell you, its like an animal testing facility..." where I'm guessing that he doesn't quite have the sense to be comparing them to the high-I.Q. folks in the white lab coats.

My bet is that he'll probably respond with some inane equivocation, some feeble (tee-hee-hee) "I was just joking" routine.

If we ourselves start buying into the Lib BS, and start to pre-emptively extend virtual appologies to these character-assasins, then this country is hading into a world of seriously deep and messy doo-doo.

If you let someone dish out the trash, please, please, please, let them likewise suffer the consequences of their actions and let them bear the brunt of the subsequent reciprocal responses of retribution.

He's a liberal supporter. You can tell that he's lying and trying to be insulting, if his lips are moving or if his fingers are. My daughters would have his piglet gibblets for lunch -- if only to feed to their puppy, Trots da Pet, a Pit Bull. (He got the name Trots da Pet, by the way, 'cause he was housebroken on the writings of Trotsky as well as on old P E True-dough campaign posters.)

L.H.& K.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Tango - Excellent points. Thanks.

Soccermom said...

Zac, writing that stuff about women at CPC youth conventions just shows your immaturity. And if that was an attempt at humour, I don't think it was funny.

Zac said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Zac said...

Well I see the wagon's have circled on ol' Zac.

Well nobody really joke funny. That's ok. Guess Riley and I are a little out of our age group here.

But yes soccermom, it does show how immature I am. Yes, RGM it's sad to see mysogeny come back. A guy like you must be heartbroken. And yes, Tango I am shallow loser. Thanks for pointing that out. Without you I'd still think I was I was a winner.

Well, If my joke offended anyone, I'm sorry but it was just that - a joke. So sorry to the CPC youth ladies, sorry to soccermom, sorry to Joanne and sorry to RGM.

L.H.&K

liberal supporter said...

I think the idea of "lining the pockets of beaurocrats in Costa Rica" is a bit of a red herring. I haven't read the Kyoto protocol, so for anyone who actually has, feel free to correct my views.

As I understand it, the idea behind Kyoto is to change pollution from what economists call an "externality" into a cost for polluters. If you do the cost analysis of comparing the cost of reducing emissions with zero (doing nothing), then it is never economic to do so. Having to pay for not reducing emissions should change the economic analysis.

Stephen's idea of tax breaks for reductions is a good one. The only problem is that it puts the government's interest on the wrong side of the equation. Reduced emissions means reduced revenue. It should also mean reduced health care costs, but not immediately.

So whether the carbon tax money goes to Costa Rica or to our government should not make a difference to the business decision of spending money to reduce emissions.

I dislike the idea that certain countries have higher emission limits, which can therefore be traded. Though it should have the effect of global reductions, it may not. The "tradeable" credits should only be based on emission reductions in other countries based on the same limits and reductions expected of us.

I think the people who negotiated Kyoto were so happy to get wide international agreement, that they overlooked these basic flaws.

In tandem with Kyoto, there should be trade tariffs for products based on the emissions of the specific industries involved. That can lead to bogus regulations "saving the environment" that are really just protectionism, but if fairly implemented, it could be a way to balance the unbalanced distribution of emission limits.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Zac - I didn't take offense, personally. Please do bear in mind however, that when you refer to the Minister of the Environment as "hot", it does nothing to further the public's desire to entice more women into politics. I don't hear many women discussing how "hot" various male politiicans are.

But maybe everyone is over-reacting here.

Liberal Supporter, thanks for that. A little too heavy for me to dissect on a holiday weekend, but I'll give it some thought.

Zac said...

Well that was Riley who refered to her as "hot", I said a few things that I probably shouldn't have though. And you are very apt in saying that this sort of attitude is the reason why many more women aren't in politics. I'll certainly keep that in mind in the future.

While I do think that Rona Ambrose is very attractive, I also respect her intellect. A master's degree in public policy is nothing to scoff at. In fact her resume is so impressive that the prime minster entrusted her with a cabinet position.

I do recall women referring to Gerard Kennedy and Stockwell Day as "hot" though. I've also heard that Trudeau had quite a female following, in fact I got to meet a lady at the LPC(O) who was a Trudeaumaniac in the sixties who still refers to him as the "sexiest" politician who ever lived.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Zac - Sorry, you're right. It was Riley. We'll have to tar and feather him. ;)

Yeah, this political correctness can go a bit too far. My guess is that Ms. Ambrose doesn't hate being regarded as attractive. But of course, that shouldn't overshadow her qualifications.

BTW, was it just me or was Jane Taber really rude during CTV's Question Period at noon? Jane kept interrupting Rona like crazy. Maybe she's jealous. lol!

Riley Hennessey said...

Vikki, RGM and others...

Riley to the Rescue...

First off...can everyone just CHILL OUT?

When I said Rona Ambrose was hot, you're darned right I meant it. When Jane Taber says gerard Kennedy is an attractive young man, she meant it too. When I say there are fire-brand young attractive CPC women.. I mean that as well.

Zac was teasing about "animal testing" relax. Furthermore no one is being mysogentistic (spelling?) on this blog. If I said "Rona get back in the kitchen where you belong" you can call me out on that. If I said "Rona's only value is that she's hot" you can call me out on that too. I've worked for female candidates, I've encouraged my own mother to run, and I strongly support women in politics.

Richard get off your HIGH horse on pornography, women and other junk and come back to reality. People need a sense of humour. Zac wasn't insulting the intelligence of any official, nor was I. If someone said "man riley can give a good speech" and someone added "he's got a cute butt too" I wouldn't be offended!

But what REALLY grinds me is the politically correct nonsense that we spew sometimes. Zac and I were amicably dolling compliments to Rona Amrbose. Zac's comments about the "animal testing" were not my taste, BUT he was tossing a joke around. Hence I took no offence and didn't think anything of it.

Unlike Zac, I'm not going to apologize. I did nothing wrong, I wrote nothing wrong, and I stand by my statements.

I not only mentioned Ambrose was attractive, I also stated she gets picked on and handles herself well, and noted how humorous she was on Rick Mercer. Richard you're going to call me out on that? Gimme a break people. Lighten up. If people are going to attack Zac and I for something so small and minute, I will reconsider posting comments in these sections despite my affection for the blog and its author.

Zac said...

Political parties make good use of it though. I remember during the election, the CPC had a desktop's available on thier website of Rona and Helena. Kinda odd how Monte Solberg or someone else didn't get one though.

The LPC did something similar but with Ruby Dhalla.

The young Liberals have buttons that say "what's Sexy? The Young Liberals." They also have brochures that say "What' Sexy? Progressive Public Policy" with a picture of Belinda next to it.

It goes both ways.

Zac said...

Hey Riley, your comments were harmless yes, but mine were a bit out of line and so I apologize for them.

I made a generalization about CPC youth. It was a joke, but it was a bit off colour.

Soccermom said...

Lighten up, Riley!

As for hot and sexy, no one does it better for the ladies than John McCallum! Oooh, that fresh from a roll in the hay hair of his just gets me goin', I tell yah! That sexy devil! (groooowwwwwl!)

Riley Hennessey said...

soccermom,

I am lightened up, just irks me when people go on moral tirades.

Also I noticed McCallum was able to bypass his usual Sunday morning hangover to preach on CTV's Question Period. He's probably the biggest joke in the Liberal party right now.

uxjze said...

lol, good one, Riley! Yes, he does look hungover most days. Just adds to the sexiness (those bedroom eyes! sigh!)

Joanne (True Blue) said...

"If people are going to attack Zac and I for something so small and minute, I will reconsider posting comments in these sections despite my affection for the blog and its author."

No, please Riley!! Not that! I'll let you post anything you want! Don't go, please!!!

Riley Hennessey said...

I'm not kidding though, word on the street from several sources I have in the party is that he is an alcoholic.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

McCallum? Yeah, I've heard that too from many sources. The guy has bags under his eyes that are just scary. And that voice!! It mkes me think of gravel on a chalkboard - with the gravel stuck in your fingernails...

Joanne (True Blue) said...

BTW, Gerard Kennedy is NOT hot.

TangoJuliette said...

Let's see...PM Pierre was considered sexy. Check out what he did to Canada.

If I want sexy, I check out my honey.

In government, I don't want sexy, I want good. I want honest. I want bright. I want hard-working.

It's the House of Parliament, not some juke-joint or singles bar. Le Cruising Chambre, I s'pose. There are some guys with the same attitude who pretend to be running churches, but they're really there 'cause it's like the old Dominion stores ads used to proclaime: "It's mainly because of the meat!"

Joanne (True Blue) said...

That's right, Tango! Bedrooms have no business in the politics of the nation.

Mac said...

Good one, Joanne!

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Thanks, Mac. That was one of my better quips.

RGM said...

No Riley, I will not do any such thing regarding "pornography, women, and other junk." The point of view that I express is mine, and I am certainly not going to change that because it makes you upset; after all, isn't this Canada, where we encourage people with a wide range of political views to come forward and exchange perceptions and points of discussion?
A high, wait, HIGH, horse, you say? Because I'm opposed to sexism-based comments? In that very vein, I'm sure that women don't like being cast into that type of categorization with pornography as being "junk." I am deeply aware of reality, far more than you realize or care to acknowledge because it clashes with your view. What exactly do you mean by "reality," anyways?
Are you opposed to the idea of a man speaking in favour of a woman's right to be seen as more than the sum of her parts? Because when you say that Rona Ambrose is your favourite MP because she "is by far the hottest MP in parliament," that's what you're doing. If you don't like the fact that you're getting called on that, don't do it. It's not something "small and minute" if you were to ask a feminist or any woman who seeks to be treated as an equal in this society and be held as someone's favourite for reasons that are more profound than "she's hot."

TangoJuliette said...

Joanne (T B):

Totally excellent! Like. Tubular. So, un-square. Migosh, who knew that people other than liberals have a creative sense of humour?

"... Bedrooms have no business in the politics of the nation...."

Nyuk-nyuk-nyuk.

Now I'm reeeeeaallllllly LUH-VIN' IT!!!

L.H.& K.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

Ha! Thanks, Tango. One of those rare moments of inspiration..

RGM - Thanks for championing the cause for women. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, as long as it doesn't cross some politically correct line which is in the eye of the observer (?).

Riley Hennessey said...

yawn...

RGM you're on a high horse cause you attack a simple comment I made which was a COMPLIMENT.

I have no time for chest-thumpers. I listed several reasons for why Ambrose was my favorite MP not just cause she was hot, you obviously didn't read my entire comment.

I'm not going to stand here and be called mysogenistic for saying someone is hot. Take a valium or thump your chest when somebody actually says something outrageous.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

O.K. Everyone chill out. No harm done.

So we all agree that Rona Ambrose has it all - looks, personality and brains. Good for her. It's a rare combination.

Sara said...

but is she getting it regular?

Sara said...

ok I got a bit down the comments, and don't have time for the rest I have to work but I'll throw my twoonie in for this part.

Kyoto has its flaws and Canada's target was not met nor was it even getting close. Therefore it was useless to us and costing more money.
This made in Canada is a good thing but yes I agree its not been decided on what it is yet. We'll see if it was worth the wait lol.

Mac said...

Is she getting what regular, Sara? :)

Has anyone see the former Liberal government's environmental plan? Did it exist or was it another one of those 'scribbled on a napkin five days before the government got defeated' things??

Oh wait... we had the "One Ton Challenge" didn't we? Yeah, there's a solid plan! Let's give a bunch of money to some Liberal-friendly advertizing firms, maybe fill Rick Mercer's pockets up a bit so he gives us some positive press...

liberal supporter said...

Doesn't the fact that the targets were not met illustrate the problem with having no financial incentive to reduce emissions? Kyoto was not in effect during the recent increases, and many polluters hoped that somehow they would not be required to make reductions in the future.

Joanne (True Blue) said...

As I understand it, we had signed onto Kyoto during the previous Liberal government, and emissions are now 35% above the Kyoto target negotiated under their watch.